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Post by Deleted on Jan 7, 2023 23:31:01 GMT
When/why did the domestication process of homos first begin, with their accelerated mutation beyond the bounds of natural selection (the "missing link")? Was it first sparked off by their discovery of fire?
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Post by Deleted on Jan 8, 2023 0:04:37 GMT
When/why did the domestication process of homos first begin, with their accelerated mutation beyond the bounds of natural selection (the "missing link")? Was it first sparked off by their discovery of fire? I think fire, weaponry, and clothing were the key to success as well as a heightened cognitive ability. |
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Post by Hardcastle on Jan 8, 2023 0:21:01 GMT
But we don't have heightened cognitive ability. We have no more cognitive ability than stone age homo sapiens (who were very much under the thumb of natural selection), or Neanderthals for that matter.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 8, 2023 4:22:27 GMT
When/why did the domestication process of homos first begin, with their accelerated mutation beyond the bounds of natural selection (the "missing link")? Was it first sparked off by their discovery of fire? I think fire, weaponry, and clothing were the key to success as well as a heightened cognitive ability. Seems like without fire (and farming, which came much later) there wasn't the ability to start ranging outside tropical rainforests. Without fire and farming we're pretty much reduced to getting enough calories from fruit like chimps, supplemented with leaves (very low calories) and bits and pieces of limited protein like slugs and bugs. Without farming and being in tropical rainforests we kind of need to be able to eat/cook meat, don't you think? We could kill the animals, but humans we don't generally go on meat very well uncooked. |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 8, 2023 4:40:27 GMT
I think fire, weaponry, and clothing were the key to success as well as a heightened cognitive ability. Seems like without fire (and farming, which came much later) there wasn't the ability to start ranging outside tropical rainforests. Without fire and farming we're pretty much reduced to getting enough calories from fruit like chimps, supplemented with leaves (very low calories) and bits and pieces of limited protein like slugs and bugs. Without farming and being in tropical rainforests we kind of need to be able to eat/cook meat, don't you think? We could kill the animals, but humans we don't generally go on meat very well uncooked. It is a lot better cooked but we handle raw just fine. |
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Post by Johnson on Jan 8, 2023 4:44:59 GMT
I think fire, weaponry, and clothing were the key to success as well as a heightened cognitive ability. Seems like without fire (and farming, which came much later) there wasn't the ability to start ranging outside tropical rainforests. Without fire and farming we're pretty much reduced to getting enough calories from fruit like chimps, supplemented with leaves (very low calories) and bits and pieces of limited protein like slugs and bugs. Without farming and being in tropical rainforests we kind of need to be able to eat/cook meat, don't you think? We could kill the animals, but humans we don't generally go on meat very well uncooked. This may be a bit of an unpopular inquiry, but what is your opinion of theories that are outside the Out of Africa Theory? |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 8, 2023 4:54:38 GMT
Seems like without fire (and farming, which came much later) there wasn't the ability to start ranging outside tropical rainforests. Without fire and farming we're pretty much reduced to getting enough calories from fruit like chimps, supplemented with leaves (very low calories) and bits and pieces of limited protein like slugs and bugs. Without farming and being in tropical rainforests we kind of need to be able to eat/cook meat, don't you think? We could kill the animals, but humans we don't generally go on meat very well uncooked. It is a lot better cooked but we handle raw just fine. I thought there was lot of risk of bacterial infection in humans from eating raw meat, well at least eating off the carcass out in the wild. So you reckon that before fire we were hunting game and eating the shit raw? What about our teeth, can they can smash up heaps of raw all day everyday? We have terrible teeth for raw meat. |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 8, 2023 5:01:57 GMT
It is a lot better cooked but we handle raw just fine. I thought there was lot of risk of bacterial infection in humans from eating raw meat, well at least eating off the carcass out in the wild. So you reckon that before fire we were hunting game and eating the shit raw? What about our teeth, can they can smash up heaps of raw all day everyday? We have terrible teeth for raw meat. My opinion that I will pass off as fact with little research behind it is- The risk was there, but so what? Modern day chimps have comparable dentition to us and do alright with meat and so did we and our associates like neanderthals who may have been a bit more open to raw meat. Fire allowed us to eat these things without worms in our ass but previously, of course. We were by no means thumbs up jolly happy fun day hooray men eating raw meat but our ancestors likely (definitely) developed higher tolerance and avoided the worst of it. If you decided to eat raw meat I wouldn't expect great results for you. (Eating "heaps" of raw meat is bad and we did not do that) |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 8, 2023 5:07:29 GMT
I thought there was lot of risk of bacterial infection in humans from eating raw meat, well at least eating off the carcass out in the wild. So you reckon that before fire we were hunting game and eating the shit raw? What about our teeth, can they can smash up heaps of raw all day everyday? We have terrible teeth for raw meat. My opinion that I will pass off as fact with little research behind it is- The risk was there, but so what? Modern day chimps have comparable dentition to us and do alright with meat and so did we and our associates like neanderthals who may have been a bit more open to raw meat. Fire allowed us to eat these things without worms in our ass but previously, of course. We were by no means thumbs up jolly happy fun day hooray men eating raw meat but our ancestors likely (definitely) developed higher tolerance and avoided the worst of it. If you decided to eat raw meat I wouldn't expect great results for you. (Eating "heaps" of raw meat is bad and we did not do that) But wouldn't you need to eat "heaps" of meat to get enough calories? This is talking before farming... I should really trace the fossil record, that should say something. |
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Post by Johnson on Jan 8, 2023 5:08:58 GMT
Seems like without fire (and farming, which came much later) there wasn't the ability to start ranging outside tropical rainforests. Without fire and farming we're pretty much reduced to getting enough calories from fruit like chimps, supplemented with leaves (very low calories) and bits and pieces of limited protein like slugs and bugs. Without farming and being in tropical rainforests we kind of need to be able to eat/cook meat, don't you think? We could kill the animals, but humans we don't generally go on meat very well uncooked. This may be a bit of an unpopular inquiry, but what is your opinion of theories that are outside the Out of Africa Theory? Like multiregional theory? |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 8, 2023 5:11:54 GMT
My opinion that I will pass off as fact with little research behind it is- The risk was there, but so what? Modern day chimps have comparable dentition to us and do alright with meat and so did we and our associates like neanderthals who may have been a bit more open to raw meat. Fire allowed us to eat these things without worms in our ass but previously, of course. We were by no means thumbs up jolly happy fun day hooray men eating raw meat but our ancestors likely (definitely) developed higher tolerance and avoided the worst of it. If you decided to eat raw meat I wouldn't expect great results for you. (Eating "heaps" of raw meat is bad and we did not do that) But wouldn't you need to eat "heaps" of meat to get enough calories? This is talking before farming... I should really trace the fossil record, that should say something. No? Just a platesworth of meat is good right? Mind you, we had other shit to eat. Like fruits and veggies we find. If we were in the cold then yeah we would be eating a lot of meat and adapting and dying because that strategy is dumb. |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 8, 2023 5:11:54 GMT
My opinion that I will pass off as fact with little research behind it is- The risk was there, but so what? Modern day chimps have comparable dentition to us and do alright with meat and so did we and our associates like neanderthals who may have been a bit more open to raw meat. Fire allowed us to eat these things without worms in our ass but previously, of course. We were by no means thumbs up jolly happy fun day hooray men eating raw meat but our ancestors likely (definitely) developed higher tolerance and avoided the worst of it. If you decided to eat raw meat I wouldn't expect great results for you. (Eating "heaps" of raw meat is bad and we did not do that) But wouldn't you need to eat "heaps" of meat to get enough calories? This is talking before farming... I should really trace the fossil record, that should say something. Hunting requires heavy energy expenditure so yes, you would need a lot of calories. Perhaps our ancestors’ third molars (wisdom teeth) helped chew raw meat properly. Meat would have been the main food source in cold winter climates. |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 8, 2023 5:12:53 GMT
Didn't we exploit a lot of aquatic resources?
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Post by Deleted on Jan 8, 2023 5:30:32 GMT
But wouldn't you need to eat "heaps" of meat to get enough calories? This is talking before farming... I should really trace the fossil record, that should say something. No? Just a platesworth of meat is good right? Mind you, we had other shit to eat. Like fruits and veggies we find. If we were in the cold then yeah we would be eating a lot of meat and adapting and dying because that strategy is dumb. Well as soon as you go into temperate zones you're having to do winters. Winter fruits have bugger all calories, but I guess you could go on that. Most veggies and roots will be very hard going without cooking. And generally low on calories for the amount of effort you put into gathering and eating. Eating raw meat, you'd probably have to just swallow it mostly without expecting to chew it all the way down. As long as it gets in the gut. I guess I can see humans persisting for a while like this on raw meat, but long-term thriving like we did? Dunno. Maybe. It's an interesting question for me. |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 8, 2023 5:32:50 GMT
No? Just a platesworth of meat is good right? Mind you, we had other shit to eat. Like fruits and veggies we find. If we were in the cold then yeah we would be eating a lot of meat and adapting and dying because that strategy is dumb. Well as soon as you go into temperate zones you're having to do winters. Winter fruits have bugger all calories, but I guess you could go on that. Most veggies and roots will be very hard going without cooking. And generally low on calories for the amount of effort you put into gathering and eating. Eating raw meat, you'd probably have to just swallow it mostly without expecting to chew it all the way down. As long as it gets in the gut. I guess I can see humans persisting for a while like this on raw meat, but long-term thriving like we did? Dunno. Maybe. It's an interesting question for me. We did not thrive at all though on such a diet IMO. |
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