Siberian Tiger vs Ussuri Brown Bear

[Deleted]

The Siberian Tiger (Panthera tigris altaica) is an endangered subspecies of tiger found in the mountain forests of eastern Russia, with a small population ranging across the border into China.
Tigers weigh 300-500lbs with an average of 400lbs, tigresses weigh 220-400lbs with an average of 260lbs.
Siberian tigers are 34-42'' in height and 7-10ft long.
They predate upon brown and black bear, deer, boar etc. along with rival predators. Which also happens to include bears, but bears are both rivals and prey.

The Ussuri brown bear (Ursus arctos lasiotus), also known as the Ezo brown bear and the black grizzly bear,[2] is a subspecies of the brown bear or population of the Eurasian brown bear (Ursus arctos arctos). One of the largest brown bears, a very large Ussuri brown bear may approach the Kodiak bear in size.[3] It is not the same subspecies as the grizzly bear.

Although the diet of an Ussuri brown bear is mainly vegetarian, being the largest predator it is able to kill any prey. In Sikhote Alin, Ussuri brown bears den mostly in burrows excavated into hillsides, though they will on rare occasions den in rock outcroppings or build ground nests.[citation needed] These brown bears rarely encounter Ussuri black bears, as they den at higher elevations and on steeper slopes than the latter species. They may on rare occasions attack their smaller black cousins.[5]
In middle Sakhalin in spring, brown bears feed on the previous year's red bilberry, ants and flotsam, and at the end of the season, they concentrate on the shoots and rhizomes of tall grasses. On the southern part of the island, they feed primarily on flotsam, as well as insects and maple twigs.[citation needed] In springtime in Sikhote Alin, they feed on acorns, Manchurian walnuts and Korean nut pine seeds. In times of scarcity, in addition to bilberries and nuts, they capture larvae, wood-boring ants and lily roots. In early summer, they will strip bark from white-barked fir trees and feed on their cambium and sap.[citation needed] They will also eat berries from honeysuckle, yew, Amur grapevine and buckthorn. In southern Sakhalin, their summer diet consists of currants and chokeberries. In the August period in the middle part of the island, fish comprise 28% of their diet.[3]
In Hokkaido, the brown bear has a diet including small and large mammals, fish, birds and insects such as ants.[6] Recent increases in size and weight, reaching 400 kg (880 lb), or possibly up to 450 kg (990 lb) to 550 kg (1,210 lb),[7] are largely caused by feeding on crops.[8]

[Deleted]

Bear wins face to face, it is considerably (ok, a lot) larger.

[Deleted]

I’m actually a bear > cat guy at parity too.

Although here the bear is significantly larger, so I definitely favour it.

[brobear]

These are my honest estimates. Considering the physical advantages that the Ussuri brown bear has over the Amur tiger, I don't feel like my estimates are biased.

1- If a full-grown male tiger were to ambush a full-grown male Ussuri brown bear: Bear wins 9 out of 10. (if the tiger manages to escape and retreat, this is still a win for the bear).

2- In a face-off confrontation: Bear wins 19 out of 20.

*Neither the ambush event nor the face-off event are likely to happen. A tiger will always choose a bear smaller than himself as prey. At a kill site, a tiger is highly unlikely to stand his ground against a full-grown male Ussuri brown bear. We must remember that a tiger will usually back down in a face-off against a female sloth bear less than half his own weight.

[brobear]

Dec 31, 2022 11:18:44 GMT @ling said:

I’m actually a bear > cat guy at parity too.

Although here the bear is significantly larger, so I definitely favour it.

In a manner of speaking, a typical Amur tiger and a typical Ussuri brown bear (both full-grown males) are roughly at HBL parity. The bear is heavier because of these two apex predators, the bear is the stronger (greater girth of neck, limbs, and torso). 

[Deleted]

Dec 31, 2022 15:10:21 GMT brobear said:

These are my honest estimates. Considering the physical advantages that the Ussuri brown bear has over the Amur tiger, I don't feel like my estimates are biased.

1- If a full-grown male tiger were to ambush a full-grown male Ussuri brown bear: Bear wins 9 out of 10. (if the tiger manages to escape and retreat, this is still a win for the bear).

2- In a face-off confrontation: Bear wins 19 out of 20.

*Neither the ambush event nor the face-off event are likely to happen. A tiger will always choose a bear smaller than himself as prey. At a kill site, a tiger is highly unlikely to stand his ground against a full-grown male Ussuri brown bear. We must remember that a tiger will usually back down in a face-off against a female sloth bear less than half his own weight.

Good to see some actually talented users coming from carnivora ^

[Hardcastle]

Dec 31, 2022 15:10:21 GMT brobear said:

2- In a face-off confrontation: Bear wins 19 out of 20.

I think that's generous to the tiger. But I guess when I think about it, while the bear is thoroughly winning the tiger may manage to desperately claw out some vital artery or something. Hypothetically. I think it's more like 1 in 100.

[oldgreengrolar]

9gag.com/gag/aqjMPxY


A size comparison between the two animals. This Siberian tiger is called Beast (info in Wildfact).

[oldgreengrolar]

Another size comparison. Credited to Undertaker.

[Deleted]

Jan 1, 2023 11:28:49 GMT oldgreengrolar said:

Another size comparison. Credited to Undertaker.

Who do you favour?

[oldgreengrolar]

/\ The larger male Ussuri brown bear 7/10 at average weights. I know there is an account of a tiger suspected to kill a male Ussuri with an 18 cm paw print. The bear was about to hibernate and it did so late. It is a rare and impressive acccount.

While there is nowhere that says that bear is a shatun bear, the bear might have hibernated late and it’s strength might have been below par. The same account also says that the tiger hunts bears up to 3 years old with confidence.

There are accounts which says that male brown bears during mating season has chased off these bears from their mother during mating season. Now Alexander Batolov said that tigers avoid male brown bears during mating season but he also said that a tiger killed a male brown bear named Chamlid which many call unconfirmed.

Sometimes rare stuff does happen .

brobear, I know you support the brown bear 9/10, do you think it is possible rare stuff might happen? I remember you once said on the Domain that we need to try hard to prove ourselves wrong.

[oldgreengrolar]

Generally, the further apart the weights, the more I will go with the male Ussuri brown bear. Finding an 800 to 1000 pound Ussuri brown bear is rare.

[Deleted]

Jan 1, 2023 13:07:44 GMT oldgreengrolar said:

/\ The larger male Ussuri brown bear 7/10 at average weights. I know there is an account of a tiger suspected to kill a male Ussuri with an 18 cm paw print. The bear was about to hibernate and it did so late. It is a rare and impressive acccount.

While there is nowhere that says that bear is a shatun bear, the bear might have hibernated late and it’s strength might have been below par. The same account also says that the tiger hunts bears up to 3 years old with confidence.

There are accounts which says that male brown bears during mating season has chased off these bears from their mother during mating season. Now Alexander Batolov said that tigers avoid male brown bears during mating season but he also said that a tiger killed a male brown bear named Chamlid which many call unconfirmed.

Sometimes rare stuff does happen .

brobear , I know you support the brown bear 9/10, do you think it is possible rare stuff might happen? I remember you once said on the Domain that we need to try hard to prove ourselves wrong.

Do you usually favour bears or cats at parity? 

Just curious since you like bears a lot.

What about you as well Bolushi?

[Deleted]

Does brobear favor the bear 9/10 at parity?

[oldgreengrolar]

Jan 1, 2023 13:19:26 GMT @ling said:

Jan 1, 2023 13:07:44 GMT oldgreengrolar said:

/\ The larger male Ussuri brown bear 7/10 at average weights. I know there is an account of a tiger suspected to kill a male Ussuri with an 18 cm paw print. The bear was about to hibernate and it did so late. It is a rare and impressive acccount.

While there is nowhere that says that bear is a shatun bear, the bear might have hibernated late and it’s strength might have been below par. The same account also says that the tiger hunts bears up to 3 years old with confidence.

There are accounts which says that male brown bears during mating season has chased off these bears from their mother during mating season. Now Alexander Batolov said that tigers avoid male brown bears during mating season but he also said that a tiger killed a male brown bear named Chamlid which many call unconfirmed.

Sometimes rare stuff does happen .

brobear , I know you support the brown bear 9/10, do you think it is possible rare stuff might happen? I remember you once said on the Domain that we need to try hard to prove ourselves wrong.

Do you usually favour bears or cats at parity?

Just curious since you like bears a lot.

I support the male bear at weight parity but only slightly. The bear has stronger bones, stronger forearms, and better at grappling. Being a plantigrade means the bear can hit harder. Big cats have better killing bites, greater agility, more explosive, and have great strength too. Therefore I will not argue with you if you support the cat at parity.

At weight parity, most Ussuri brown bears are female and most Amur tiger are male. Some of the male Ussuri brown bears around 400 pounds do overlap in weight with the tigers.
I rarely debate nowadays.