Cougar vs. Wild Horse

[PumAcinonyx SuperCat]

VS 

[PumAcinonyx SuperCat]

I've recently gotten fascinated with ''Cougar vs. Ungulates'' battles. So, I thought this one would be fun.



For starters, the cougar is a prolific horse killer - they've been known over the centuries to be persistent vermin to colt raising for horse owners. But even more than that, they have also proven themselves to be capable of taking down even full-grown horses of both genders: stallions and mares.



Young and Goldman present pretty interesting information about the cougar's predation with regard to equines (horses for the most part and then the burro to a lesser degree) - 

• Merriam quotes C. H. Townsend, stating that back in the 1880s, in the Shasta County hills, colt raising was deemed as PRACTICALLY IMPOSSIBLE. Mr. Townsend even references a Mr. J. B. Campbell who reports that he never had the chance to see more that 2 or 3 of his colts on his stock range at any given time. The reason? Cougars were killing them as soon as they were born.
  

• Vernon Bailey records a very catastrophic case of cougar predation on horses. Over the course of 7 months (barely over half a year), cougars killed 52.5% of the saddle horses on a community ranch, the vast majority of brooding mares, and ALL the colts. Bear in mind that saddle horses and brood mares are all full-grown individuals.
  

• J. Stokley Ligon is of the belief that cougars relish horse flesh so much that they actually forget about their own safety in their pursuit of it - they'll stop at nothing to sink their fangs into some horse delicacy. He also believes that it is not an unusual occurrence for cougars to take down adult horses. He records NINE cases of saddle horse fatalities on just one ranch, during the winter of 1912-1913. 
  
  
• B. H. Beauchamp and his dogs pursued a cougar. They reached a spot that couldn't be passed through on horseback, so he alighted from his horse, tied it to a tree and continued on foot. The chase became longer than he had bargained for. It soon got too dark and had to call it quits. He thought his horse would be safe until the next morning, so he slept in a cabin. The next day, he went to meet his horse, and found that it had been attacked and killed by another cougar while he was away. A fierce fight had occurred between feline and equine as evidenced by the cougar's ''crime scene'' : 
  

Taken From: The puma, mysterious American cat. Part I: History, life habits, economic status, and control (Pages 140-141)

[PumAcinonyx SuperCat]

It is true that the vast majority of horses that cougars kill are foals/colts (that's how it is with all predators), but as shown above, these cats, when opportunity presents itself are able to pull down even adult equines, even with a good amount of frequency as to wipe out more than half of the saddle horses on a pasture in just 7 months.



You may not appreciate the cougar's power to kill equines until you understand just how deadly what they are going up against is. To give you an idea of just how tough, rugged, and challenging horses are, I highly recommend that you go through this page, just to get an appreciation of equine tenacity.



The page shows just how bloodthirsty horses can be, even making mention of certain horses that destroyed wolves, were man-eaters, had a taste for blood (meat-eating), and attacked soldiers during warfare with great ferocity.

It talks about the magnificent weapons with which horses are endowed to defend themselves against both man and wild predators, including phenomenal agility, great strength, powerful hooves, and even their teeth (yes, horses bite!). It also mentions that it is a very jejune thing to think that horses are defenceless animals whose only means of surviving danger is to ''take to their heels.'' Very great page, I found it interesting.

[bongoeurycerus]

Below is some data on the weights of wild horses in the US:

(Credit to Apex Boy)

We can see that wild horses tend to weigh 200 to 400 kg (and the Mongolian Przewalski’s Horse would generally weigh 250–300 kg, and the Spiti horses that are predated by snow leopards around the Himalayas and Urals Mountains are far smaller, at 160 kg in females and 185 kg in males), and i would consider 300 to 400 kg horses out of the threshold of animals that a puma could kill in a face-to-face fight more than 50% of the time. While I consider most equids to be slightly inferior to the more heavily horned cervids and bovids in those fights, in the case of fighting predators equids are superior. The fact that they can retaliate by kicking by the hind legs on the run, and the fact these kicks are extremely unpredictable and long-ranged, means that these are highly effective weapons against predators.

Now I definitely wouldn’t support a 250 kg stallion zebra over a 120 kg lioness but the fact that zebras can escape by out-wrestling the lioness should mean that a heavier, more powerful horse should deal far better against a puma (I suppose this fight involves a especially large puma of 70-100 kg). 


I support the horse but the felid does have its chances, especially against an infirm individual.

[PumAcinonyx SuperCat]

Other than the cases posted above, here is some more information regarding of cougar predation on/interactions with horses/other equines:

• Enos Mills lost his mule to a cougar attack which he described as intense but brief. The cougar demonstrated extreme patience in waiting for the perfect moment to strike, staying on a boulder for at least 24 hours until the mule passed by: 
  

 

Taken From: Watched by wild animals (Pages 195-196)

• After probably killing it, a cougar was seen by M. E. Musgrave to drag an estimated 800 or 900-pound horse for some 25 to 30 feet, as shown by tracks in the snow. Testament to the cougar's superb muscular strength: 
  

 

Taken From: SOME HABITS OF MOUNTAIN LIONS IN ARIZONA (Pages 283-284)

• According to The Cougar Network's Puma Field Guide, cougar predation on horses is described as rare, and typically involving foals when attacks occur. A reason for this is that the mechanization of ranching operations has decreased the need for horses, and many ranchers now purchase full-grown horses that are trained, instead of raising them from birth: 
  

Taken From: Puma Field Guide (Pages 22 $26)


Pictures of a foal that got killed by a puma: 


 



Taken From: Puma Field Guide (Page 23)


Adult horses can defend themselves better, and some end up carrying scars from failed predation attempts by pumas, like this one:

 

 

Taken From: Puma Field Guide (Page 25) 

• In South America, both the jaguar and puma kill horses, but Paul Fountain states that cougars, as a rule, can only overpower foals, with adults being killed more frequently by jaguars. Adult horse predation is very risky, as one kick can send a puma ''rolling helpless in the dust'' : 
  

Taken From: The great mountains and forests of South America (Page 75)

• An adult mare was seen defending her colt from a puma attack. Both cat and horse fought skilfully, but the horse prevailed after sending a kick into the cat's hip. It should be noted that the cougar nearly succeeded in bringing her down during the battle: 
  

Taken From: Watched by wild animals (Pages 189-191)

[PumAcinonyx SuperCat]

With all that said, there is one VERY MAJOR factor that inhibits cougar predation on horses in a portion of their range. That's black bears. A very thorough investigation showed that cougar predation on horses is GREATLY influenced by American black bears that kleptoparasitize the cats' kills. In areas where bear densities were high, cougars preyed more heavily on mule deer, and in areas of lower bear densities, horses were utilised more regularly: 



 

Abstract (Page 1) 






 

(Pages 9-10) 




(Page 10) 




(Page 10) 


Taken From: Recolonizing carnivores: Is cougar predation behaviorally mediated by bears?


Note that the absence of predation in certain areas is NOT representative of inability to kill horses (adults included). It is a DELIBERATE, CONSCIOUS, WILLFUL decision by cougars to overlook horses because their environment is inconducive for horse predation.



This sort of thing also applies to leopards mostly not killing zebra in Africa (since pumas killing horses is analogous to leopards killing zebra). The leopards are deliberately not preying on zebra because the circumstances in which they exist makes zebra predation a foolish thing to do. Again, as evidenced by the cougar-bear-horse study, it is NOT inability of leopards to take down zebra. Rather, it is an inconvenient habitat that mitigates the predation.

[PumAcinonyx SuperCat]

Thanks bongoeurycerus . I was planning to tag you since I wanted to get an input from the herbivore fans. 

What does everyone else think about ''Cougar vs. Horse''? Drop your thoughts. 

wermthewerm Bolushi Hardcastle @ling  lincoln grippingwhiteness grampa CoolJohnson kevin Shortridge ophio @firejaguar2022 duriaantiquior s Methane Musth oldgreengrolar slaughterhouse

[lincoln]

If the cougar has an ambush it can do it and they have done it, but if the horse shakes off the initial attack then it probably wins, might even stomp the cougar to death, but has some injuries, the horses kicks would also be deadly 

[Bolushi]

I think the cougar can win this in an ambush, but you'd need a very large cat to have a chance of winning against a stallion face to face.

[s]

Nov 27, 2023 16:57:13 GMT Bolushi said:

I think the cougar can win this in an ambush, but you'd need a very large cat to have a chance of winning against a stallion face to face.

Wild Horses are small compared to most Domestic Horse breeds though

Przewalski Horse: 12-14 hands tall
Andalusian Horse (medium sized breed): 15-16 hands tall
Shire Horse (large sized breed): 16-17 hands tall

[Bolushi]

Nov 27, 2023 17:04:37 GMT s said:

Nov 27, 2023 16:57:13 GMT Bolushi said:

I think the cougar can win this in an ambush, but you'd need a very large cat to have a chance of winning against a stallion face to face.

Wild Horses are small compared to most Domestic Horse breeds though

Przewalski Horse: 12-14 hands tall
Andalusian Horse (medium sized breed): 15-16 hands tall
Shire Horse (large sized breed): 16-17 hands tall

Wild horses in North America descend from domestic horses though, those are what "wild horses" in North America are. There are very large powerful domestic horses like the draft horse, and yes wild horses are more conservative in size, but still formidable.

[Bolushi]

Nov 27, 2023 15:40:40 GMT PumAcinonyx SuperCat said:

It is true that the vast majority of horses that cougars kill are foals/colts (that's how it is with all predators), but as shown above, these cats, when opportunity presents itself are able to pull down even adult equines, even with a good amount of frequency as to wipe out more than half of the saddle horses on a pasture in just 7 months.



You may not appreciate the cougar's power to kill equines until you understand just how deadly what they are going up against is. To give you an idea of just how tough, rugged, and challenging horses are, I highly recommend that you go through this page, just to get an appreciation of equine tenacity.



The page shows just how bloodthirsty horses can be, even making mention of certain horses that destroyed wolves, were man-eaters, had a taste for blood (meat-eating), and attacked soldiers during warfare with great ferocity.

It talks about the magnificent weapons with which horses are endowed to defend themselves against both man and wild predators, including phenomenal agility, great strength, powerful hooves, and even their teeth (yes, horses bite!). It also mentions that it is a very jejune thing to think that horses are defenceless animals whose only means of surviving danger is to ''take to their heels.'' Very great page, I found it interesting.

I hear some areas cougars kill a lot of wild horses and even prefer larger ones, and regularly get knocked and are generally tougher than deer and maybe even elk-eating cougars. That's what "colein" (aka Comfylounge) was saying, if I remember correctly. 

[oldgreengrolar]

Nov 27, 2023 16:16:40 GMT PumAcinonyx SuperCat said:

Thanks bongoeurycerus . I was planning to tag you since I wanted to get an input from the herbivore fans. 

What does everyone else think about ''Cougar vs. Horse''? Drop your thoughts. 

wermthewerm Bolushi Hardcastle @ling  lincoln grippingwhiteness grampa CoolJohnson kevin Shortridge ophio @firejaguar2022 duriaantiquior s Methane Musth oldgreengrolar slaughterhouse

I think the cougar makes a fine predator of the horse.