Animal Statistics

[Deleted]

This thread is simply for anything related to calculating things that are related to animals. 

[Deleted]

I have always wanted to know how much force is behind a Great white shark's ram. There are no calculations online. Luckily it's quite easy to calculate:

F = m * a -- Force = mass x acceleration 
a = (vf - vi) / t -- where vf = final velocity and vi = initial velocity 
a = (11.1 m/s - 0 m/s) / 2 s a = 5.55 m/s^2 -- assuming it takes 2 sec to reach swimming speed
m = 1110 kg -- weight of shark

F = m * a F = 1110 kg * 5.55 m/s^2 F ≈ 6160.5 Newtons (N)

6160.5 N seems about right. For comparison a mature bull cattle exerts a force of around ~8000 N, probably a little more. But despite the cattle's larger force, the shark would be doing more damage. As the shark's nose has a small surface area, unlike the cattle's head. Kinda like a bullet.

[Hardcastle]

Jul 3, 2023 15:32:05 GMT @ling said:

I have always wanted to know how much force is behind a Great white shark's ram. There are no calculations online. Luckily it's quite easy to calculate:

F = m * a -- Force = mass x acceleration 
a = (vf - vi) / t -- where vf = final velocity and vi = initial velocity 
a = (11.1 m/s - 0 m/s) / 2 s a = 5.55 m/s^2 -- assuming it takes 2 sec to reach swimming speed
m = 1110 kg -- weight of shark

F = m * a F = 1110 kg * 5.55 m/s^2 F ≈ 6160.5 Newtons (N)

6160.5 N seems about right. For comparison a mature bull cattle exerts a force of around ~8000 N, probably a little more. But despite the cattle's larger force, the shark would be doing more damage. As the shark's nose has a small surface area, unlike the cattle's head. Kinda like a bullet.

But why would the shark's nose be able to endure such an impact? Usually when animals are built to endure massive collisions they have special anatomical adaptations precisely for that function. Can they really just swim full speed into things and nose the shit out of them without suffering any ill effects?

[Deleted]

Jul 3, 2023 15:55:43 GMT Hardcastle said:

Jul 3, 2023 15:32:05 GMT @ling said:

I have always wanted to know how much force is behind a Great white shark's ram. There are no calculations online. Luckily it's quite easy to calculate:

F = m * a -- Force = mass x acceleration 
a = (vf - vi) / t -- where vf = final velocity and vi = initial velocity 
a = (11.1 m/s - 0 m/s) / 2 s a = 5.55 m/s^2 -- assuming it takes 2 sec to reach swimming speed
m = 1110 kg -- weight of shark

F = m * a F = 1110 kg * 5.55 m/s^2 F ≈ 6160.5 Newtons (N)

6160.5 N seems about right. For comparison a mature bull cattle exerts a force of around ~8000 N, probably a little more. But despite the cattle's larger force, the shark would be doing more damage. As the shark's nose has a small surface area, unlike the cattle's head. Kinda like a bullet.

But why would the shark's nose be able to endure such an impact? Usually when animals are built to endure massive collisions they have special anatomical adaptations precisely for that function. Can they really just swim full speed into things and nose the shit out of them without suffering any ill effects?

They have adaptions. I'll name the main ones; Sharks possess a specialised sensory system called the ampullae of Lorenzini (which enables them to detect electrical signals produced by animals), these are surrounded by a gel-filled canal system that can absorb and dissipate shockwaves, protecting the delicate sensory structures. Sharks also have a reinforced skull, especially in the area surrounding their noses. The skull is thick and composed of multiple layers of tough connective tissues, which act as a protective shield during collisions. And, the tissues in the shark's nose are dense and packed tightly together, providing additional strength and support.

[Hardcastle]

I was aware of the sensory system in their nose and actually thought it made their nose especially sensitive, hence the instruction to punch them in the nose if they are attacking you? Is that an old wives tale?

I've never seen a shark skull, it's always just their jaws. I guess because the cartilaginous skull doesn't preserve? But yeah I can't even imagine what it looks like.

[Deleted]

Jul 3, 2023 16:08:18 GMT Hardcastle said:

I was aware of the sensory system in their nose and actually thought it made their nose especially sensitive, hence the instruction to punch them in the nose if they are attacking you? Is that an old wives tale?

I've never seen a shark skull, it's always just their jaws. I guess because the cartilaginous skull doesn't preserve? But yeah I can't even imagine what it looks like.

Well their nose is especially sensitive. What I should have said when I was referring to the ampullae of Lorenzini is that it has a gel-layer in front of it to protect it from actually getting severely injured, but the sensory organs are indeed still sensitive.

So punching a shark in the nose will deteriorate it away from you due to the nose's sensitivity, but the nose itself is too well protected for any damage to actually have been done.

And here is a shark's skull:

[Deleted]

Jul 3, 2023 16:16:59 GMT @ling said:

Jul 3, 2023 16:08:18 GMT Hardcastle said:

I was aware of the sensory system in their nose and actually thought it made their nose especially sensitive, hence the instruction to punch them in the nose if they are attacking you? Is that an old wives tale?

I've never seen a shark skull, it's always just their jaws. I guess because the cartilaginous skull doesn't preserve? But yeah I can't even imagine what it looks like.

Well their nose is especially sensitive. What I should have said when I was referring to the ampullae of Lorenzini is that it has a gel-layer in front of it to protect it from actually getting severely injured, but the sensory organs are indeed still sensitive.

So punching a shark in the nose will deteriorate it away from you due to the nose's sensitivity, but the nose itself is too well protected for any damage to actually have been done.

And here is a shark's skull:

Their skin is also very tough.