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Post by Bolushi on May 17, 2023 5:41:52 GMT
Harpy eagle vs ocelot
Jagdterrier vs basenji
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Musth
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Post by Musth on May 17, 2023 10:05:48 GMT
1. Not sure…But the Harpy is one of the most impressive and possibly the most impressive eagles. I just think cats can do good against birds of prey. Better suited against than canids are. Claws extremely agile and explosive. Ability to jump and catch the bird in the air, tackle it and bring it down. Maybe in a face to face fight on the ground of bird didn’t fly at all cat would win. This is the birds toughest match up in this bracket. Canids don’t do well against birds of prey. Jackals and wolves in Eurasia are killed by falconers using golden eagles. Harpy is bigger and stronger than a golden. A Harpy would also beat both dogs in my opinion to be honest.
2. Not even a fight….. jagdterrier stomps and is a way tested animal. A basenji is more of a natural dog…. Vs a jagdterrier is an against nature type of dog…. Similar like an apbt.
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ophio
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Post by ophio on May 17, 2023 13:51:43 GMT
1. Not sure…But the Harpy is one of the most impressive and possibly the most impressive eagles. I just think cats can do good against birds of prey. Better suited against than canids are. Claws extremely agile and explosive. Ability to jump and catch the bird in the air, tackle it and bring it down. Maybe in a face to face fight on the ground of bird didn’t fly at all cat would win. This is the birds toughest match up in this bracket. Canids don’t do well against birds of prey. Jackals and wolves in Eurasia are killed by falconers using golden eagles. Harpy is bigger and stronger than a golden. A Harpy would also beat both dogs in my opinion to be honest. Ik 2. Not even a fight….. jagdterrier stomps and is a way tested animal. A basenji is more of a natural dog…. Vs a jagdterrier is an against nature type of dog…. Similar like an apbt. 1. Yea eagles and cats seems it can go either way and there are natural accounts of both taking the other. Imo I'd think the harpy eagle has to get it the first strike or the cat will win which would be tough if it isn't an ambush. 2. Yea part of the reason why I made the fight. Funny thing is Im actually considering a basenji and the first thing i read on basenji forum is to not leave them outside. In terms of prey drive they seem on par with the jagd in that there are reports they have attacked and killed large racoons, coyotes, and 100+ pound deer despite being a tiny dog relatively. In terms of proportions the jagd does seem more powerful, but the jagd has smaller legs and a bigger body so I'd think the basenji has a stamina and speed advantage. |
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Post by Hardcastle on May 17, 2023 14:39:22 GMT
1. Not sure…But the Harpy is one of the most impressive and possibly the most impressive eagles. I just think cats can do good against birds of prey. Better suited against than canids are. Claws extremely agile and explosive. Ability to jump and catch the bird in the air, tackle it and bring it down. Maybe in a face to face fight on the ground of bird didn’t fly at all cat would win. This is the birds toughest match up in this bracket. Canids don’t do well against birds of prey. Jackals and wolves in Eurasia are killed by falconers using golden eagles. Harpy is bigger and stronger than a golden. A Harpy would also beat both dogs in my opinion to be honest. I agree, in fact I think the Ocelot was basically the only contender that MIGHT beat the harpy eagle. |
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Post by Deleted on May 17, 2023 14:56:08 GMT
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ophio
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Post by ophio on May 17, 2023 15:01:27 GMT
1. Not sure…But the Harpy is one of the most impressive and possibly the most impressive eagles. I just think cats can do good against birds of prey. Better suited against than canids are. Claws extremely agile and explosive. Ability to jump and catch the bird in the air, tackle it and bring it down. Maybe in a face to face fight on the ground of bird didn’t fly at all cat would win. This is the birds toughest match up in this bracket. Canids don’t do well against birds of prey. Jackals and wolves in Eurasia are killed by falconers using golden eagles. Harpy is bigger and stronger than a golden. A Harpy would also beat both dogs in my opinion to be honest. I agree, in fact I think the Ocelot was basically the only contender that MIGHT beat the harpy eagle. I remember there were some cases of wildcats hurting golden eagles bad in counterattack. Think they may have even been ambushed |
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Post by Deleted on May 17, 2023 15:03:53 GMT
So what's the final then? Jagd vs Eagle?
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Musth
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Post by Musth on May 17, 2023 18:11:42 GMT
So what's the final then? Jagd vs Eagle? Sent from my SM-A105FN using Tapatalk Yes IMO and eagle stomps. |
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Musth
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Post by Musth on May 17, 2023 18:25:27 GMT
1. Not sure…But the Harpy is one of the most impressive and possibly the most impressive eagles. I just think cats can do good against birds of prey. Better suited against than canids are. Claws extremely agile and explosive. Ability to jump and catch the bird in the air, tackle it and bring it down. Maybe in a face to face fight on the ground of bird didn’t fly at all cat would win. This is the birds toughest match up in this bracket. Canids don’t do well against birds of prey. Jackals and wolves in Eurasia are killed by falconers using golden eagles. Harpy is bigger and stronger than a golden. A Harpy would also beat both dogs in my opinion to be honest. Ik 2. Not even a fight….. jagdterrier stomps and is a way tested animal. A basenji is more of a natural dog…. Vs a jagdterrier is an against nature type of dog…. Similar like an apbt. 1. Yea eagles and cats seems it can go either way and there are natural accounts of both taking the other. Imo I'd think the harpy eagle has to get it the first strike or the cat will win which would be tough if it isn't an ambush. 2. Yea part of the reason why I made the fight. Funny thing is Im actually considering a basenji and the first thing i read on basenji forum is to not leave them outside. In terms of prey drive they seem on par with the jagd in that there are reports they have attacked and killed large racoons, coyotes, and 100+ pound deer despite being a tiny dog relatively. In terms of proportions the jagd does seem more powerful, but the jagd has smaller legs and a bigger body so I'd think the basenji has a stamina and speed advantage. There are always exceptions to the rule. I’m sure there could be some scrappy and beast little Basenji. But one is a performance bred animal vs one is more or often just bred to be a companion present day. And mine you a jagd is bred and fully expected to fully on fight any quarry close to its size, and if it doesn’t it’s considered a full. I can’t say the same with a Basenji. A jagd is just meant to be a much harder animal than a basenji. |
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ophio
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Post by ophio on May 17, 2023 19:00:26 GMT
1. Yea eagles and cats seems it can go either way and there are natural accounts of both taking the other. Imo I'd think the harpy eagle has to get it the first strike or the cat will win which would be tough if it isn't an ambush. 2. Yea part of the reason why I made the fight. Funny thing is Im actually considering a basenji and the first thing i read on basenji forum is to not leave them outside. In terms of prey drive they seem on par with the jagd in that there are reports they have attacked and killed large racoons, coyotes, and 100+ pound deer despite being a tiny dog relatively. In terms of proportions the jagd does seem more powerful, but the jagd has smaller legs and a bigger body so I'd think the basenji has a stamina and speed advantage. There are always exceptions to the rule. I’m sure there could be some scrappy and beast little Basenji. But one is a performance bred animal vs one is more or often just bred to be a companion present day. And mine you a jagd is bred and fully expected to fully on fight any quarry close to its size, and if it doesn’t it’s considered a full. I can’t say the same with a Basenji. A jagd is just meant to be a much harder animal than a basenji. Idk it's crazy that despite being pampered pet dogs, they have the ability to go toe to toe with coyotes in every one of these interactions and one has even turned into a coyote killer despite no special training "Blaze has killed two coyotes now. The first one I didn't even know about, until he came back covered in blood. None of it was his, but we found the coyote the next day at the edge of the fence. Scarey enough, we were out side round the firepit and never heard a thing… The second time, he was whining to get out of the house, I let him out, thinking he had to go pee. He stood on the deck, staring out past the sheep pen, then made a weird warning snarl sound. The sheep moved to the closer fence to us, then Blaze took off like a shot. I thought he was going to kill the sheep. He ran right past them, that when I saw the grey blur take off. Blaze overtook him no problem and took him down. That was last year when Blaze was twelve." basenjiforums.com/topic/3590/coyote-attacked-my-bAfaik basenjis aren't your run of your mill dog and probably have some "dog" in them genetically. I think dingoes and dogs are closer related to each other than either are to basenjis. If pet basenji are like that id think feral basenjis would be at least as impressive p4p as dingos liekley more so Would it be enough to take out a jagd? Idk As for human bred dogs being more formidable than natural dogs. Wolves do have some advantages over dogs at equal size namely height. I'd think the basenji would posses these advantages here |
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Musth
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Post by Musth on May 17, 2023 20:12:39 GMT
There are always exceptions to the rule. I’m sure there could be some scrappy and beast little Basenji. But one is a performance bred animal vs one is more or often just bred to be a companion present day. And mine you a jagd is bred and fully expected to fully on fight any quarry close to its size, and if it doesn’t it’s considered a full. I can’t say the same with a Basenji. A jagd is just meant to be a much harder animal than a basenji. Idk it's crazy that despite being pampered pet dogs, they have the ability to go toe to toe with coyotes in every one of these interactions and one has even turned into a coyote killer despite no special training "Blaze has killed two coyotes now. The first one I didn't even know about, until he came back covered in blood. None of it was his, but we found the coyote the next day at the edge of the fence. Scarey enough, we were out side round the firepit and never heard a thing… The second time, he was whining to get out of the house, I let him out, thinking he had to go pee. He stood on the deck, staring out past the sheep pen, then made a weird warning snarl sound. The sheep moved to the closer fence to us, then Blaze took off like a shot. I thought he was going to kill the sheep. He ran right past them, that when I saw the grey blur take off. Blaze overtook him no problem and took him down. That was last year when Blaze was twelve." basenjiforums.com/topic/3590/coyote-attacked-my-bAfaik basenjis aren't your run of your mill dog and probably have some "dog" in them genetically. I think dingoes and dogs are closer related to each other than either are to basenjis. If pet basenji are like that id think feral basenjis would be at least as impressive p4p as dingos liekley more so Would it be enough to take out a jagd? Idk As for human bred dogs being more formidable than natural dogs. Wolves do have some advantages over dogs at equal size namely height. I'd think the basenji would posses these advantages here Can you post some Afaik basenjis? Actually I know decker terrier and rat terrier have high amounts of basenji in them. The deckers and rat terrier are inferior when it comes to grit, said to be hard pressed to find one that can kill a coon. (A coon can be extremely tough by the way especially a big Boar Coon). Patterdales and Jagd are rated much more highly than them when it comes to fighting a coon, and would be no different than for other animals as well. As for a small dog beating coyotes… unless if it was a sub 25lbs coyote or young pup, I would bet on the coyote almost every time. I hate to be that guy but coyote kill small terriers and almost all terrier man agree that a coyote will kill a terrier even a jagd. Maybe perhaps if a jagd above 25lbs and a small coyote I could definitely see the dog winning but not after a tough fight honestly. For whatever reason dogs in the mid to under 20lbs range stack horribly against coyote. Just because of the huge reach advantage and honestly size advantage a coyote enjoys over dogs that size. They literally tower over dogs that size and have a huge power advantage in their bite. They can bite the dog where the dog can’t reach them. However 30lbs and above dogs start kick coyotes asses(some do). It never made sense to me either but after hearing countless reports of terrier man losing dogs to lone coyotes and admitting these dogs don’t stand a chance against lone coyote then I have changed my mind. Most of the time imo a coyote is way too big for the terrier even if the coyote has only a 10lbs advantage the terrier at the smaller weights doesn’t have the physics to hurt a coyote. For example a 15lbs Patterdale will get killed by a 25lbs coyote. Watching the odd apbt rag doll the huge dog in the box this never made sense to me. But it comes down to more physics than anything. A sub 20lbs animal is built way different than an animal that is above 30lbs (which is what most coyotes are; although it depends on the region where you live). |
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ophio
Ruminant
Posts: 230
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Post by ophio on May 17, 2023 21:11:09 GMT
Idk it's crazy that despite being pampered pet dogs, they have the ability to go toe to toe with coyotes in every one of these interactions and one has even turned into a coyote killer despite no special training "Blaze has killed two coyotes now. The first one I didn't even know about, until he came back covered in blood. None of it was his, but we found the coyote the next day at the edge of the fence. Scarey enough, we were out side round the firepit and never heard a thing… The second time, he was whining to get out of the house, I let him out, thinking he had to go pee. He stood on the deck, staring out past the sheep pen, then made a weird warning snarl sound. The sheep moved to the closer fence to us, then Blaze took off like a shot. I thought he was going to kill the sheep. He ran right past them, that when I saw the grey blur take off. Blaze overtook him no problem and took him down. That was last year when Blaze was twelve." basenjiforums.com/topic/3590/coyote-attacked-my-bAfaik basenjis aren't your run of your mill dog and probably have some "dog" in them genetically. I think dingoes and dogs are closer related to each other than either are to basenjis. If pet basenji are like that id think feral basenjis would be at least as impressive p4p as dingos liekley more so Would it be enough to take out a jagd? Idk As for human bred dogs being more formidable than natural dogs. Wolves do have some advantages over dogs at equal size namely height. I'd think the basenji would posses these advantages here Can you post some Afaik basenjis? Actually I know decker terrier and rat terrier have high amounts of basenji in them. The deckers and rat terrier are inferior when it comes to grit, said to be hard pressed to find one that can kill a coon. (A coon can be extremely tough by the way especially a big Boar Coon). Patterdales and Jagd are rated much more highly than them when it comes to fighting a coon, and would be no different than for other animals as well. As for a small dog beating coyotes… unless if it was a sub 25lbs coyote or young pup, I would bet on the coyote almost every time. I hate to be that guy but coyote kill small terriers and almost all terrier man agree that a coyote will kill a terrier even a jagd. Maybe perhaps if a jagd above 25lbs and a small coyote I could definitely see the dog winning but not after a tough fight honestly. For whatever reason dogs in the mid to under 20lbs range stack horribly against coyote. Just because of the huge reach advantage and honestly size advantage a coyote enjoys over dogs that size. They literally tower over dogs that size and have a huge power advantage in their bite. They can bite the dog where the dog can’t reach them. However 30lbs and above dogs start kick coyotes asses(some do). It never made sense to me either but after hearing countless reports of terrier man losing dogs to lone coyotes and admitting these dogs don’t stand a chance against lone coyote then I have changed my mind. Most of the time imo a coyote is way too big for the terrier even if the coyote has only a 10lbs advantage the terrier at the smaller weights doesn’t have the physics to hurt a coyote. For example a 15lbs Patterdale will get killed by a 25lbs coyote. Watching the odd apbt rag doll the huge dog in the box this never made sense to me. But it comes down to more physics than anything. A sub 20lbs animal is built way different than an animal that is above 30lbs (which is what most coyotes are; although it depends on the region where you live). Yea the coyote killer basenji is a male which could approach 30 pounds or more for feral ones. Im not sure how big the coyotes were but I'd think that they were probably a good bit smaller or the same size. In the western usa male coyotes average 25-30 while females average 20-25 so it's very possible the basenji was bigger but probably not by much. But again, an anonymous forum post could likely be bs. But again this forum consistently paints basenjis as good predators which is something they are known to do. 2 year old basenji takes a "large raccoon" "My Max got hold of a large raccoon in my backyard one night when he was about 2. My boyfriend at the time went out and saw the raccoon on its back with Max on his throat. He tried to separate them, but it was too late for the raccoon. I've kept my dog door down at night ever since. The two Bs I have now seem to be fearless and much more instinctively predatory than Max was–but fortunately I haven't had any raccoons etc in the backyard....yet." basenjiforums.com/topic/4792/redmund-kills-another-deerWhat's an afaik basenji? |
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Musth
Ruminant
Posts: 141
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Post by Musth on May 17, 2023 22:36:04 GMT
Can you post some Afaik basenjis? Actually I know decker terrier and rat terrier have high amounts of basenji in them. The deckers and rat terrier are inferior when it comes to grit, said to be hard pressed to find one that can kill a coon. (A coon can be extremely tough by the way especially a big Boar Coon). Patterdales and Jagd are rated much more highly than them when it comes to fighting a coon, and would be no different than for other animals as well. As for a small dog beating coyotes… unless if it was a sub 25lbs coyote or young pup, I would bet on the coyote almost every time. I hate to be that guy but coyote kill small terriers and almost all terrier man agree that a coyote will kill a terrier even a jagd. Maybe perhaps if a jagd above 25lbs and a small coyote I could definitely see the dog winning but not after a tough fight honestly. For whatever reason dogs in the mid to under 20lbs range stack horribly against coyote. Just because of the huge reach advantage and honestly size advantage a coyote enjoys over dogs that size. They literally tower over dogs that size and have a huge power advantage in their bite. They can bite the dog where the dog can’t reach them. However 30lbs and above dogs start kick coyotes asses(some do). It never made sense to me either but after hearing countless reports of terrier man losing dogs to lone coyotes and admitting these dogs don’t stand a chance against lone coyote then I have changed my mind. Most of the time imo a coyote is way too big for the terrier even if the coyote has only a 10lbs advantage the terrier at the smaller weights doesn’t have the physics to hurt a coyote. For example a 15lbs Patterdale will get killed by a 25lbs coyote. Watching the odd apbt rag doll the huge dog in the box this never made sense to me. But it comes down to more physics than anything. A sub 20lbs animal is built way different than an animal that is above 30lbs (which is what most coyotes are; although it depends on the region where you live). Yea the coyote killer basenji is a male which could approach 30 pounds or more for feral ones. Im not sure how big the coyotes were but I'd think that they were probably a good bit smaller or the same size. In the western usa male coyotes average 25-30 while females average 20-25 so it's very possible the basenji was bigger but probably not by much. But again, an anonymous forum post could likely be bs. But again this forum consistently paints basenjis as good predators which is something they are known to do. 2 year old basenji takes a "large raccoon" "My Max got hold of a large raccoon in my backyard one night when he was about 2. My boyfriend at the time went out and saw the raccoon on its back with Max on his throat. He tried to separate them, but it was too late for the raccoon. I've kept my dog door down at night ever since. The two Bs I have now seem to be fearless and much more instinctively predatory than Max was–but fortunately I haven't had any raccoons etc in the backyard....yet." basenjiforums.com/topic/4792/redmund-kills-another-deerWhat's an afaik basenji? Sorry I’m your previous post you said Afaik Basenji was probably just a spelling mistake. |
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ophio
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Posts: 230
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Post by ophio on May 17, 2023 22:37:05 GMT
Yea the coyote killer basenji is a male which could approach 30 pounds or more for feral ones. Im not sure how big the coyotes were but I'd think that they were probably a good bit smaller or the same size. In the western usa male coyotes average 25-30 while females average 20-25 so it's very possible the basenji was bigger but probably not by much. But again, an anonymous forum post could likely be bs. But again this forum consistently paints basenjis as good predators which is something they are known to do. 2 year old basenji takes a "large raccoon" "My Max got hold of a large raccoon in my backyard one night when he was about 2. My boyfriend at the time went out and saw the raccoon on its back with Max on his throat. He tried to separate them, but it was too late for the raccoon. I've kept my dog door down at night ever since. The two Bs I have now seem to be fearless and much more instinctively predatory than Max was–but fortunately I haven't had any raccoons etc in the backyard....yet." basenjiforums.com/topic/4792/redmund-kills-another-deerWhat's an afaik basenji? Sorry I’m your previous post you said Afaik Basenji was probably just a spelling mistake. Oh sorry its an acronym for As Far As I Know. There were some studies done on this but basenjis are genetically quite distant from other dogs and even dingos and represent a primitive lineage somewhere in between wolves and dogs. Might make them more scrappy and tenacious and give them the heightened kill instincts many keepers report |
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